Did Jesus Exist? Evidence from History, Biblical Sources, and Mythology
Is Christ a Historical Figure?
“Of course
Jesus existed. Everyone knows he
existed. Don’t they?”
Bart Ehrman. Did Jesus Exist?[1]
The issue of the historicity of Christ has been “hotly
debated” in recent years, starting from about the mid-1800s. This short study will attempt to lay the
issue to rest, delving into the historicity of Christ, the historicity of the
Biblical sources that discuss Christ, and the lack of historical basis for the
“copy-cat” hypothesis.[2]
- 42 sources within 150
years of Christ’s death talking about his life. (far more than Mohammad or
even the Caesar that reigned during his time… 9 non-Christian sources
talking about him in the same time frame, 10 if you count Luke.)
- Tacitus, Pliny the
Younger, Flavius Josephus, Clement, Ignatius, etc.
- Many secularists admit He
existed[3]
- Zeitgeist the movie, which pushes the Christ Myth Theory…
tries to talk way these points by saying
- “Four historians are
typically referenced to justify Jesus’s existence. Pliny the Younger, Suetonius, Tacitus,
are the first three. Each one of
their entries consists of only a few sentences at best and only refer to
the Christus or the Christ, which in fact is not name but a title. It means ‘Anointed one.’ The fourth source is Josephus and his
source has been proven to be a forgery for hundreds of years.”
- And… that’s how they
dismiss all of that evidence.
- They’re wrong on the “only four historians” – only
four are officially historians (how many would be needed to affirm
anything, then?). Couldn’t confirm
existence of almost any figure in history using this logic.
- They’re wrong on the
implication of “only a few
sentences.”
- In Tacitus’s Annals XV,
44, he said “Christus, the founder of the [Christian] name, was put to
death by Pontius Pilate, procurator of Judea in the reign of
Tiberius. But the pernicious
superstition, repressed for a time, broke out again, not only in Judea,
where the mischief had originated, but through the city of Rome also.”
- Tacitus most likely
reference government officials, perhaps getting some info from Pliny,
who was another historian. He
critically evaluated information (even criticized Pliny in Annals XV,
55). He confirms between hearsay
and confirmed accounts nearly 70x in his History.[4]
- Not a forgery because
it’s very negative – “superstition,” “mischief.” All manuscripts we have of his
writings contain this passage.[5]
- The other two (Suetonius
and Pliny) are not forgeries.[6]
- They’re wrong when
referring to Josephus. Josephus
was a 1st century Pharisee and historian (3 years removed from
time of Jesus). Refers to John the
Baptist, Pontius Pilate, etc… that are not disputed.[7]
- “At this time there was
a wise man who was called Jesus, and his conduct was good, and he was
known to be virtuous. And many
people from among the Jews and the other nations became his
disciples. Pilate condemned him
to be crucified and to die. And
those who had become his disciples did not abandon their loyalty to
him. They reported that he had
appeared to them three days after his crucifixion, and that he was
alive. Accordingly they believed
that he was the Messiah, concerning whom the Prophets have recounted
wonders.”[8]
- He has a second passage,
which has been in every passage of his Antiquities that has been discovered,[9] discussing James, the
brother of the “so-called” Christ.
- Some researchers have
wondered if the similarity between Josephus and the gospel message of
Luke (specifically the road to Emmaus section – Luke 24) may have been
based off the same source (or, perhaps Josephus merely used common
Christian material to write that section of his history – think of the
purpose for which Luke/Acts was written).[10]
- Luke 24:19 – “And he
said unto them, What things? And
they said unto him, Concerning Jesus
of Nazareth, which was a [man] prophet
mighty in deed and word
before God and all the people:”
- Josephus (preserving
original word order) – “There happened about this time Jesus wise man – if a man one may call him
indeed – for he was of amazing deeds
a worker.”
- Compare Luke
24:19-21;25-27 (removing the “flashback scene” from Luke 24:22-23) with
Josephus Antiquities 18.63
- “About this time there was Jesus, a
wise man, if indeed one ought to call him a man. For he was one who
performed surprising deeds and was a teacher of such people as accept the
truth gladly. He won over many Jews and many of the Greeks. He was the
Christ. And when, upon an accusation by the principal men among us,
Pilate had condemned him to a cross, those who had in the first place
come to love him did not give up their affection for him. He appeared to
them spending a third day restored to life, for the prophets of God had
prophesied these things and countless other marvels about him. And the
tribe of the Christians, so called after him, has still to this day not
disappeared.”
- As for NT, 5000 Greek
Manuscripts exist, w/in 60 years, entire NT is completed, 10 of the 27
books (at least) are penned by companions of Christ. They claim to be reporting history
(unlike mythology reporters). They
record place names and minutiae that locals would find obvious facts.
- Ramsay did work in
Modern-day Turkey, validated that Luke’s history was accurate to the minutest
detail.[11]
- Nelson Glueck[12], Jewish
archaeologist, said “It may be stated categorically that no
archeological discovery has ever controverted a single biblical
reference. Scores of archeological findings have been made which confirm
in clear outline or in exact detail historical statements in the Bible”[13]
- Classic historian AN Sherwin-White[14]
(1911-1993) would also back this up, saying “Any attempt to reject its
basic historicity even in matters of detail must now appear absurd. Roman historians have long taken it for
granted.”[15]
- Example of wrong logic. On
rationwiki, a noted atheist and liberal website (satirical, at times), the
following two quotes are used. “Dr. Paul L. Maier: Absence of evidence is not
evidence of absence. Simply because something isn't mentioned doesn't mean
it didn't exist. Michael Shermer: Sorry - in science, we don't allow that
form of reasoning.”
- How do you apply the
scientific method to history?
- Go back to probability
reasoning. Burden of proof is to
the party making the claim, no matter what that claim may be.
- See https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/12/18/did-historical-jesus-exist-the-traditional-evidence-doesnt-hold-up/?utm_term=.a3c4937950e3
for splendid non-history and invective against existence of Christ.
But isn’t Jesus just a copy-cat of all those
ancient religions?
“Egyptology has the unenviable distinction of being one of
those disciplines that almost anyone can lay claim to, and the unfortunate
distinction of being probably the one most beleaguered by false prophets.”[16]
o
Most “Christ conspiracy” stuff comes from Gerald
Massey – but the only reason he could get away with a lot of crack-pot stuff
was because the Rosetta Stone hadn’t been translated fully yet. (Joseph Smith would get away with wrongly
translating the Book of Abraham this way as well)
o
Edward Carpenter was another (Pagan and Christian Creeds) who
contributed to this.
§
Alice Bailey, a Theosophist, quotes Carpenter[17], “I cannot of course go at length into these
different cults, but I may say roughly that all or nearly all the deities above
mentioned it was said and believed that: 1)They were born on or very near our
Christmas Day., 2) They were born of a Virgin-mother, 3) in a Cave or
Underground Chamber., 4) They led a life of toil for Mankind., 5) And were
called by the names of Light-bringer, Healer, Mediator, Savior, Deliverer, 6)
They were, however, vanquished by Powers of Darkness, 7) And descended into
Hell or the Underworld, 8) They rose again from the dead, and became pioneers
of mankind to the Heavenly world, 9) They founded Communions of Saints and
Churches into which disciples were received by Baptism, 10) And they were
commemorated by Eucharistic meals.”[18]
So here’s how it works: Massey – Graves – Carpenter
influence Blavatsky, Bassant, and Bailey (Theosophy) who then influence various
members of today’s strange spiritists[19],
as well as DM Murdock (also known as Acharya S), who is the main source for the
Zeitgeist movie and Christ Conspiracy movement.
o
Acharya S wrote extensively on this subject,
also wrote companion guide to the Zeitgeist movie, and responded to criticisms
by doubling down.[20]
Ø
She’s known for lacking citations (or at least
reliable ones), as well as dubious research (in spite of what you’d read about
her on her own website). Christians have
come out, refuting her work.[21] There are even atheist refutations of her
work.
Ø
She’s a proponent of Astro-Theology[22]
[23]
– which uses the Christ Myth movement as a basis and then tries to say that the
stories in the Bible are myths that replay the astrology of the zodiac. They will also play up the connection (which
only works in English) between God’s Son (Christ) and the sun (as if there’s
supposed to be symbolism there).
o
Jesus birth, Star in the East combine to point
to the rising sun (since December 25th is near the winter solstice, this is a
metaphor). They’ll include the “Three
Kings” as the three stars in Orion’s belt as well.
o
Problem?
Linguistic scholars can’t really buy into it. Most of these connections only work with
English. (example: “Sun” and “Son” only
works in English)
So Was Christ a
copy-cat?[24]
• Horus[25]
– claims Born on Dec. 25th[26],
Born of a virgin[27],
star in the east, adored by 3 kings[28],
teacher at age 12, Baptized/ministry at 30[29]
, 12 disciples (no references to this), performed miracles (such as
resurrecting “Asar,”[30]) “Lamb of God”/The “Light,”[31] Crucified,[32] Dead for 3 Days,[33]
Resurrected[34]
• Other
gods? Many of the old gods were revived
post-Christ in the Roman Mystery religions (such as Plutarch, etc) – they were
ancient gods who were changed after Christ, so bring no evidence to our discussion. If anything, Gnosticism, paganism, etc.
borrowed from Christian sources, not the other way around.
• Jesus’s
ministry – Luke 2 – nothing mythological about it.
[1]
Bart Ehrman, a former Christian turned agnostic, wrote a book in 2012 called Did Jesus Exist: The Historical Argument for
Jesus of Nazareth, in which he, as an unbeliever, still defends the
historicity of Jesus on account of the abundant early sources and historical
evidence for the existence and life of the man.
He has even debated those he call “mythicists” on the topic, such as he
describes on his blog. https://ehrmanblog.org/bart-ehrman-robert-price-debate-did-jesus-exist/
(9/22/17)
[2]
There are several sources that are useful for further study, as well as serving
as the bulk of informational resources for this. For more information, see
http://www.bibleevidences.com/archeology.htm, “Zeitgesist, History Rewritten,”
by Chris White. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hbvfqa_mzLw,
“Horus Ruins Christmas,” by Lutheran Satire https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0-EgjUhRqA,
“Mithra? Attis? Really, Rob Bell?” by James White, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TsVkeMZCkOg
also, as you’ll see in various footnotes, “thedevineevidence.com” has links to
several exhaustive articles, and may be cited periodically.
[3]
Bart Ehrman - “No serious historians believe that Jesus didn’t exist”; Richard
Dawkins also “Jesus Christ probably existed; Michael Grant <Atlas of
Classical History> (atheist) “To sum up, modern critical methods fail to
support the Christ myth theory. It has
again and again been answered and annihilated by first rank scholars. In recent years, no serious scholar has
ventured to postulate the non-historicity of Jesus’ or at any rate very few,
and they have not succeeded in disposing of the much stronger, indeed very
abundant, evidence to the contrary.”
[4] http://www.thedevineevidence.com/jesus_similarities.html
(see note on this site, below)
[5]http://thedevineevidence.com/jesus_history.html
- regrettably, these pages no longer exist (as of 9/27/27) and so must be
accessed by the “waybackmachine” internet archiver. https://web.archive.org/web/20140315213718/http://thedevineevidence.com/jesus_history.html
[6]
See “Life of Claudius” 25.4 by Gaius Suetonius Tranquillus, where he says “As
the Jews were making constant disturbances at the instigation of Chrestus,
[Claudius] expelled them from Rome.” And
“Pliny’s letter to Emperor Trajan,” by Pliny the Younger, where he says “I
asked them directly if they were Christians… those who persisted, I ordered
away… Those who denied they were or ever had been Christians… worshiped both
your image and the images of the gods and cursed Christ…” (he continues,
referring it to “Nothing more did I find than a disgusting, fanatical
superstition.”)
[7]
For a brief summary of the difficulties with this passage, called the Testimonium Flavianum, see http://www.josephus.org/testhist.htm
(accessed 10/21/17) (TF on this page
stands for Testimonium Flavianum)
[8]
Antiquities XVIII, 3:2
[9]
Antiquities XX 9:1 “So [Ananus]
assembled a council of judges, and brought before it the brother of Jesus, the
so-called Christ, whose name was James, together with some others, and having
accused them as lawbreakers, he delivered them over to be stoned.
[10]
Computer modeling has shown similarities between Luke-Josephus in this
area. It is different enough that it’s
most likely it didn’t actually steal straight from Luke. However, perhaps Luke-Josephus both acquired
information from similar sources (no doubt the men on the road to Emmaus would
not have kept their encounter with the Lord secret, and thus would have been a
great source of information about the risen Christ, as well as Old Testament
prophecies that were fulfilled in Christ.)
(see http://www.josephus.org/question.htm
and “The Coincidences of the Emmaus Narrative of Luke and the Testimonium of
Josephus” (http://www.josephus.org/GoldbergJosephusLuke1995.pdf)
(accessed 10/21/17)
[11]
He originally came into the study trying to prove Luke to be inaccurate, but
eventually concluded “…more recently I found myself brought into contact with
the Book of Acts as an authority for the topography, antiquities, and society
of Asia Minor… in various details the narrative showed marvelous truth… I
gradually came to find it a useful ally in some obscure and difficult
investigations.” (Ramsay, St. Paul the
Traveler and the Roman Citizen, 1982, p. 8. He’d also say “Luke is a historian of first
rank; not merely are his statements of fact trustworthy… this author should be
placed along with the very greatest of historians.” (for more information, see
Ramsay, The Bearing of Recent Discovery
on the Trustworthiness of the New Testament, 1915, p. 222.
[12]
http://www.bibleevidences.com/archeology.htm
[13]
Nelson Glueck, Rivers in the Desert,
1960, pg 31.
[14]
Note concerning Sherwin-White, when submitting his thesis, his examiners, Cary
and Syme, commended its “maturity of judgment such as one hardly dares to
expect from a young scholar.” (The Journal of Roman Studies. 84:
xi-xiv.) He would revise this thesis for
publication as The Roman Citizenship
(1939), which has become regarded as “a classic of modern historical writing on
Rome.” (Proceedings of the British
Academy 87: 455-470)
[15]
A.N. Sherwin-White, Roman Society and
Roman Law in the New Testament, 1963, pg. 189.
[16]
This quote apparently originated in a research poll done by W Ward Gasque of
twenty leading Egyptologists. (if you locate original author, let me know mikewareing@wolfmountain.org)
(See Shattering the Christ Myth, p.
227, note 1, which links to History News Network’s article by Gasque “The
Leading Religion Writer in Canada … Does He Know What He’s Talking About?”)
[17] See
her book, From Bethlehem to Calvary (Alice Bailey), which can be read online,
at least in part on http://www.light-weaver.com/bk/bethlehem/beth1053.html ;
this specific quote of hers is actually secondary, where she quotes Pagan and
Christian Creeds, by Edward Carpenter, pp. 20,21.
[18] Note...
many times these people will quote recent sources talking about ancient things,
or will say, as Bailey did, ͞I cannot of course go at length into these
different cults...͟Uncited sources are useless sources.
[19] These
include, but are not limited to Jordan Maxwell, David Icke, and Michael
Tsarion, all of which are discussed and refuted at some length by Chris White
(all on youtube.com), but which fall outside our discussion.
[20] Her
website can be visited at http://www.truthbeknown.com/ and refutations and
back-and-forths can be easily accessed through google searches for “Acharya S
refuted,͟” one is
http://www.risenjesus.com/a-refutation-of-acharya-ss-book-the-christ-conspiracy
. Remember, the burden of proof is on
them to present original sources that show ancient gods/goddesses following
Christ͛s pattern. This has yet to be
done (http://zeitgeistchallenge.com/).
[21]
Mike Licona (http://www.risenjesus.com/a-refutation-of-acharya-ss-book-the-christ-conspiracy)
and JP Holding (http://www.tektonics.org/af/achy01.php#jb)
[22] A
major supporter of this theory was Manly P. Hall, who said ͞When the Mason
learns that the key to the warrior on the block is the proper application of
the dynamo of living power, he has learned the mystery of his Craft. The seething energies of Lucifer are in his
hands, and before he may step onward and upward, he must prove his ability to
properly apply energy.͟The Lost Keys of Freemasonry http://www.manlyphall.org/text/the-lost-keys-of-freemasonry/chapter-iv-the-fellow-craft/
[23] Jordan
Maxwell is another proponent of this theory.
His website says “As long as the Sun comes up each day, life on Earth
will continue forever. Therefore, it was
said in the ancient texts that everlasting life was ͚the gift͛ that the Father
gives through his Sun. For...͚God so
loved the world that he gave his only begotten SUN that we may have life
everlasting” http://www.jordanmaxwell.com/astrotheology.html
(He will twist Scripture repeatedly to compare Christ to the Sun, as the
absence of sun brings darkness... etc)
[24]
See http://mail.slife.org/lifes-basic-questions/messengers/87-jesus/1033-jesus-christ-in-comparative-mythology-by-wiki
for a summary of the various ways similarities (if they even existed) could
have cropped up, as well as various theologians’, historians’, and writers’
views of the so-called “Christ Myth” theory.
[25]
No record exists of him being baptized, especially by “Anup” the baptizer. Nor did he have 12 disciples (doesn’t have
any in the Book of the Dead or other
accounts), and he wasn’t crucified (no myth actually says how he died, so the
“dead three days and resurrected” can’t be proven either.)
[26]
Acharya S’s logic? He was born every
day, so of course he was also born on the 25th.
[27]
Born actually through sort-of a rock, not a virgin (and not one named
“Meri.” Isis was never called “Meri,”
except if you attach the suffix “-meri” to a name which means “beloved,” which
was used for many gods.
[28]
See Gerald Massey “the Star in the East that arose to announce the birth of the
babe (Jesus) was Orion, which is therefore called the star of Horus. That was once the star of the three kings;
for the ‘three kings’ is still a name of three stars in Orion͛s belt...”
problems are many-fold. “Three Kings” is
the name we give to it now... but not then.
The stars would be below the horizon, not to mention the Bible never
talks about three or kings in relation to the magi, and the other issue – this
event happens repeatedly throughout the year.
[29] Nothing
is said in the sources. Acharya says in The Christ Conspiracy, “The sun at its
zenith, or 12 noon, is in the house or heavenly temple of the ‘Most High’; thus,
‘he’ begins ’his Father’s work’ at ‘age’ 12.” “The sun enters into each sign of
the zodiac at 30 [degrees]; hence, the ‘Sun of God’ begins his ministry at
‘age’ 30.”
[30] Contrary
to claims, “Lazarus” and “Asar” are not linguistically connected. Lazarus comes from “Eleazar,” or “God is my
Hope.” “Asar” is from Egyptian origin,
referring to Osiris the father of Horus, who was resurrected (sort of) by Isis.
[31]
Source for this? “The Light,” – he was a
god of the sun… “God’s anointed son” was a combination of two ideas found in
separate places, so a place where he has an ointment on his head, and a place
where he’s called “son.” Voila! You have “anointed” “Son,” “Lamb
of God” – so says Massey, at least, who doesn’t do a good job of citing
sources, and who twists the original sources.
[32]
Crucifixion did not exist when Horus supposedly existed – metaphors are evoked,
and does not “denote a direct resemblance to the crucifixion narrative of Jesus
Christ.” (Zeitgeist Companion Guide) – portrayal of gods and goddesses in
cruciform.
[33]
See Tryggve ND Mettinger, The Riddle of
Resurrection: “Dyring and Rising Gods” in Ancient Near East, p. 4,7.
[34]
For a thorough treatment of this, see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hbvfqa_mzLw
, from 47:00 on. Also, these people tend
to really like Horus. For example as
well as a refutation, see the following links in order. “Bill Maher – Jesus, Horus, Mithra, Krishna –
Religulous (2 mins)” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4lLiRr_mT24
and “bil maher’s ridiculous lies and false claims from ‘religulous’ Jesus and
horus comparison” (sic) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jImzkeMRf_Y
. Honestly, you can skip the first, but
it’s there for context. Also, WLC
summarized it as well, “Jesus and the Story of Osiris and Horus (William Lane Craig)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6AZqOO2FJA
and “Refuting Zeitgeist the Movie – Mark Foreman, PhD” (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5KHA9f6kHs)
(11/29/17)
ReplyDelete" As this Jesus was not a god, but an ordinary mortal man,
probably gay, anything that has been invented and founded in his name,
no matter how nice it may sound,
has no legitimacy, credibility and truth attached to it.
Take away the fake miracles attributed to Jesus,
take away the church invented fake saints
and their fake invented church miracles,
all the Christian theology comes crumbling down, leaving Christianity and the Church completely naked.
Christianity is founded on the Jewish invented God known as yahweh and everything else about Jesus was invented
by SAUL the Jewish man known as the Apostle Paul and the Church Fathers.
Let us face the truth.
The apostle Paul (Jewish man SAUL who never ever met Jesus) and the Church Fathers,
invented and created the huge theology, dogma, story and rules etc....around Jesus the religious figure.
Also the Roman Empire participated in the invention of the Christian religion.
It was this empire that financially and in every other way possible
supported the creation of the Church and its religion
as it sought to have a religion (a weapon) in which to be able to control the masses of people
from the many various nationalities in its empire.
The Christianity it assisted in creating was the ideal weapon for the empire to achieve its goal.
(Christianity teaches people to turn the other cheek, do not ask for very much in the today as you will be rewarded in the afterlife in a "Heaven - Paradise" with an everlasting life etc.)
That is why it so brutally then went out of its way to force this religion on to all the people of the empire.
Thus from this religion creating the "one People - one religion system"
and all loyal to the emperor and the empire.
Throughout history the Church has always stood by the side of the ruling establishment
....controlling the masses for the establishment....a great partnership for the benefit of both.
That is also why in later years the colonial rulers all over the world forced the Christian religion
on to the native peoples of their colonies.
We have all heard of the expression whereby the natives say " they gave us a book and told us to close our eyes
and pray,
when we opened our eyes we had the book
and they had all the land ".
So what did this gay Jesus actually achieve on a personal level?!
Jesus achieved absolutely nothing!"
However,
.. any debate on this is useless, since a god
needs to be proven - First.
who are you quoting? I've noticed a lot of your statements start off with a quotation mark, and I've yet to see the origin of that - or is it a typo? Anyway, you can assert all you want that the miracles were "falsely attributed" or that Saul never met Jesus, or bring up times where people abused other people in the name of Christianity, but assertions don't disprove anything. You've yet to give any proofs historically where Christianity was created by Rome, or that anything originated at the Council of Nicaea, or anything of the sort.
DeleteChristianity became "dominant" after the fall of Rome because the priests were the only ones with any experience in rulership, so they became defacto rulers in a lot of ways.
Rome persecuted Christians for being atheists because they didn't believe in their gods - that's not "ideal empire creation," since Rome rose to power while worshiping Mithra and all sorts of other gods, and accepting the gods of the conquered people, not being exclusive, as Christianity clearly is.
Jesus wasn't gay... that's unbelievably clear.
God exists... that also is plainly see through abductive reasoning methods and the Kalaam Cosmological Argument as well as other approaches.
Rants do not prove gods!!
DeleteProof requires evidence - and - You got NOTHING!!